I recently interviewed Mr. Robert Yu, who is a fellow Cal Bear and received his MS in Biology from Northwestern. Like Marie Cheng, Robert also took the road less traveled, and got his MBA from Tsinghua University. Robert is currently working at Pfizer China.

Robert was very insightful and generous in sharing his journey.  I’m sure you’ll enjoy this interview.

Background
I was born in Hong Kong and moved to Vancouver, Canada when I was 6 years old.  I spent K-12 in Vancouver before moving to the U.S. for my undergraduate and graduate education.  I majored in molecular and cell biology at UC Berkeley and did my my master’s in biotechnology at Northwestern University.

After graduate school, I moved back to the Bay Area to work at Recombinant Capital (now Deloitte-Recap), a small boutique consulting firm specializing in structuring deals and alliances for the biotechnology industry.

After 4.5 years at Recap as an analyst, I decided to move to China initially to study and improve my Chinese.  While studying Chinese at Tsinghua, I found out that the university had an international MBA program partnered with MIT-Sloan.  I applied, was excepted and after graduation, started working for Pfizer China in the strategic planning and business development team.  I am presently transitioning over to a new role within Pfizer China to support one of the business unit/commercial functions.

Why move to China?
My move to China was more initially for more personal than professional reasons.

For starters, my parents are Chinese and I grew up in a fairly Chinese household (my parents mostly speak to me in Cantonese).

Secondly, I came to the realization that having a poor command of the Chinese language for someone like myself was just unacceptable.  I just felt that I needed to know more about my family’s cultural heritage and of the stories and places that my parents spoke so fondly.

Thirdly, I have been visiting China since 1992 and have been enthralled and completely swept away with the pace of change in the country. I just wanted to be witnessing all these changes personally rather than be reading about them thousands of miles away.

One could say that my reasons for coming were personal/emotional/cultural and that ultimately, I had the fortunate luck of having a career here in China.

First job in China
My first job in China stemmed from a summer internship.  Between my first and second year of my MBA, I interned at the Pfizer China office.  I was not expecting them to invite me back but 6 months after my internship ended, Pfizer called me out of the blue to ask if I were interested in returning to support the strategic planning and business development team.  After a few rounds of interviews, I was offered a great role with the team.

Language and culture are probably the biggest challenges that I can think of off of the top of my head.

I have the advantage/disadvantage of being both a foreigner and Chinese.  I walk the delicate and fine line of both worlds.  I am expected to have perfect Chinese and understand all cultural subtleties (anything less and I would considered a sell-out) while acting as the “bridge” and conduit between the language and cultural divide.  Much of what is important is implied and not stated.  Nothing is ever 100% concrete so a large amount of flexibility is required.

The changes in China are so rapid that it is indeed a challenge to quickly adapt.  Be flexible and try to enjoy the ride.

Post MBA Plans, etc.
I am, for the most part, living out my post MBA plans.  I am working a great job in China for a multinational.  I don’t know if I will stay in China indefinitely.  This very much depends on what my job prospects are here in addition to my family needs.  I will be getting married soon and I do have to think about raising children in China.  I am not sure if I am willing to put my children through the grinder of the Chinese education system.  In a country with so many people, what is believed to be the most efficient way to assess talent is through rigorous examinations.  The pressures are immense and the fate of a child is often determined by a set of exams.

My advice is to learn Chinese and learn it well.  No employer will say exactly how much you need and often give vague requirements like “strong command, proficient” etc.  Ideally, it would be very helpful to be able to participate in discussions in Chinese. Having a good command of Chinese is not just for communicating within the office but also to live and really understand the day-to-day of China.  I would argue that one only gets a partial experience, at best, of China without having made a concerted effort with the language and culture.

As I have mentioned above, if you look Chinese, then your language requirements are a lot higher.  Granted, my observations so far have indicated that if you are sent from HQs to China, then your skills far outweigh the need for Chinese language fluency; however, if you are asking to come to China as oppose to being asked to come, be prepared.

Second piece of advice is to be flexible.  China is an ever changing place that requires a lot of flexibility.  Be prepared to adapt quickly.  At times, it feels like a roller coaster ride but that is part of being in China.

The job market is very competitive here.  Not only overseas Chinese (hua ren or hua qiao) are coming to work, but also returnees (hai gui: mainland Chinese born, bred and raised in China who left for overseas education and work experience) are also coming back.  They bring with them a high degree of professionalism and a broad and in-depth skill set as well as the language and cultural understanding on both sides of the divide.  The bar for entry is definitely getting higher every year.

Still, China is an ever growing place (GDP numbers have been in the double digit and is estimated to be around 8% for this year) so opportunities do very much exist.   Although the level of sophistication and professionalism is going up quickly, there still remains a big talent gap and shortage in China.  Just be very clear and focused on what you offer and are able to deliver.

The days of the expat packages/lifestyle are quickly dying.  They do exist but it’s reserved for the high level executives who are sent here from headquarters abroad.  If compensation is that important, then by all means, work a job at HQ for a few years and then be posted or assigned to China.  Keep in mind though that China is changing so quickly that by the time you return, your knowledge and understanding of China may not be as relevant (the pace of change is something like 1 year in China = 5-7 years in the U.S.).

Be prepared to manage your expectations.  Not all streets are lined with gold and just living in China is a true test of your committment to being here.  From basic things like setting up a bank account to ordering food, the simple daily and mundane tasks may push you re-evaluate your reasons for coming to China.  Yes, the major cities like Beijing and Shanghai have many of the comforts of an international city; however, once outside of the more developed Tier 1 cities, don’t be shy about witnessing and experiencing China in its true colour and light.

Related post:

• Foreign Young Professionals in China Mini Series #1: Interview with Ms. Marie Cheng

China holds a special appeal to many ambitious young professionals in the United States and around the world. But, many people are unsure or apprehensive about going to work in China, given the cultural, language and other barriers. I recently conducted an interview with Ms. Marie Cheng, who was born and educated in the United States and Singapore, but chose to pursue her MBA study at the prestigious Tsinghua University School of Economics and Management (Tsinghua SEM) and has been working in China’s high tech industry.

I first got to know Marie when I saw her insightful comments on the blog. I was very impressed by how Marie has chosen a unique path to pursue her MBA study at Tsinghua University and pursued a career in China. Enjoy the interview!

What’s your background?

I was born in Westchester, NY, and raised in Ridgewood, New Jersey.  When I was 14, and when my brother, the last of my 3 older siblings, had just graduated high school, he packed up and prepared for college (also Berkeley!) while my parents, grandmother, and I packed our house up for Singapore, where my parents grew up before moving to the US after they got married.  I finished high school at a British international school called United World College of South East Asia (UWCSEA).  There are quite a few UWC’s around the world, all of which tout a version of the British system and, more importantly, the IB.  I graduated with the IB and went back to the states.

I went to the University of Michigan and got a degree in Economics, had a couple of odd jobs and such then.  Since a degree in Economics isn’t exactly a ‘direction’ in life, I went to Denver to help my dad start his medical private practice, setting up the internal computer network, running the back-of-house operations and backup and such, and doing some insurance claims.  It wasn’t my dream job, but it was ok.

What made you decide to move to China?

The summer between high school and University of Michigan, my parents decided to take me on a little tour of Greater China.  My mom was on business in Hong Kong, so we went there first, staying in a nice hotel.  Then we went to Shanghai, then Taipei.  I was blown away by Shanghai.  Even then, 10 years ago, it was bustling and smelly and what I felt seemed like a sense of a Chinese self, something I’d never thought to have before.  So I promised I’d go back sometime, just to explore.  I left my dad’s office in 2004 to take an English teaching position in Nanjing, just to try both teaching and China for a year.  Then I never left.

My reasons for going was a growing curiosity for what it meant to be "Chinese". While I grew up in a large family that was happy to celebrate Chinese holidays together at home, we were in the US and seeing Shanghai was outside of what I had ever imagined.  I saw trendy, busy, working, functioning people.  I saw something more than the Model Minority.  Right or wrong, I saw people who looked very in charge of their destiny.  And they knew how to be Chinese, and I didn’t really get what it meant.  So, I went to find roots, make roots, understand roots.  Post college sometimes felt like a let-down, and I didn’t feel ready to just join the rat race and work on professional development, but I did want to work on my personal development.  And, admittedly, I ran away a bit.  All of us who are here have "ran away" to some extent.

I also feel there is a natural follow-up to this question.  Why did I want to stay?  I stayed after the first year because after so much time I didn’t feel I had learned much Chinese, and this time wanted to see if I could turn my time in China into "direction".  I still didn’t know what I wanted.  But I could tell that staying in China was going to be a boon for me.  Later I stayed because I loved it, the gritty China that was always an adventure, even if it was just going out to buy groceries at the wet market.  Then I stayed for the work opportunities, for the freedom, and because I met my boyfriend who also loved being here.  I stayed for the MBA, the MBA opportunities, and now we stay because we have good jobs that serve China, serve global business, and meet our needs.  It sometimes takes its toll on you, but overall we still love China.

How did you get your first job in China?

My first job in China in 2004 was with a prominent high school in Nanjing.  Many other foreign teachers there said they went through friends or paid agencies to help them find positions and make all the visa arrangements.  I had a family friend of my mother’s who had been playing teachers in China and she had heard of a vacancy and had me contact them directly.  I remember thinking that the contact didn’t look quite so professional (it was in English), but I figured they were not very professional.  Turns out this can be the case for a lot of Chinese companies in terms of document conversion into English.

My MBA internships and jobs have been obtained in different ways.  Most of the time someone I knew had info on an opening and could introduce me, and as opposed to me asking them for help (because i didn’t know to), they approached me to see whether I was interested.  That was because they have seen my hard work and attitude in the MBA, and to them that was enough reason to introduce me to their contact.  The interviews were always interesting because they wished to test both my Chinese and English, and were surprised to hear my Chinese accent; my Chinese is pretty good now if I do say so myself, considering I learned it as an adult.  I was told that my multiculturalism would be a boon in the office, and indeed it seemed it was.  In my most recent interviews, that has been repeatedly cited as an asset, as well as bilingualism, and a demonstrate passion for the industry. 

What are some of the biggest challenges of working in China?

This depends on who and "what" you are.  If you are a Caucasian coming to China to work for the first time, language and culture will certainly be big challenges, but so long as you come with an open mind, and demonstrate yourself to be this way, you can be "forgiven" for not having great Chinese or for having no understanding of culture.  Why?  This is because it isn’t expected of you; after all, you’re white.

If however you are an ABC/overseas Chinese, your challenges are greater on all fronts.  You are expected to have a good grasp of Chinese, or at least a steep learning curve, and some inherent understanding of culture.  Fair or not, the local Chinese can’t help but see you through this lens because you ARE Chinese, look Chinese, and whatever passport you have, you are of Chinese origin. 

There is even more to consider if you are not white, not Chinese, but from somewhere else in Asia.

I wrote my MBA graduation thesis on the importance of building trust in the multicultural workplace in China, and find that the two biggest challenges, from my perspective, are:  1)  Knowing what is *really* expected of you as an employee and a person, and what assumptions have already been made about you based on your background, and 2) knowing how to navigate language and culture to build real trust.

One thing I notice from own MBA experience is that MBAs tends to hang out in their own circles. Do you find yourself hang out mostly with your fellow foreign students? Or there are a lot of interactions with the local students?

During the MBA, yes, you could argue it was easier to hang out with other foreign students than local Chinese, because of shared upbringing.  Often though, what mattered to me more was a shared outlook and attitude, and that did not consistently come from any one nationality or ethnicity.  I count among my closer friends 2 local Chinese, one Taiwanese American, a girl from Hong Kong, and a dear friend from Kenya. 

Recalibrating my attitude towards my time in China often helped me have better friendships with the Chinese.  Group projects, proven reliability, etc, were also the lubricants in fast growing friendships.  Going out to KTV was also a great way to interact.

How about language and communication? How did you pick up the Chinese language?

I’ve been studying Chinese on and off since high school, and even had a semi-functional level while taking the mandatory classes in college.  I largely lost it after that and promised to improve it after moving to China.  It has been a hard long process, but essentially I took a year to study it full time; 4 hours in the mornings, working on my own business in the afternoons.  By the time I hit 4-5 months of study I hit a critical mass in my vocabulary, level of comfort in conversing, and I learned so much faster in the remaining 4-5 months.  I have been trying to learn as much as possible in the last 3 years since I finished the 1 year course.  I took a 1on1 course for a while, focusing on reading of the news and talking about every day events, activities, and situations.

Piece of advice:  Learning Chinese is like tackling projects at work.  There are 4 major components of Chinese:  Speaking, Listening, Writing, and Reading.  If you are pressed for time, you prioritize, but ideally you learn them all.  You devise how much time you devote to it a week, you determine necessary resources, and you work on it alone or others, and with diligence and serious dedication.  You have to really focus on learning. 

Is the Tsinghua MBA application process pretty similar to US/EU MBA programs? I read from the Tsinghua MBA web site that foreign students tend to live off campus while the locals live in the dorm. How did you like your living arrangement and social interactions while you were a student at Tsinghua?

The application process was different when I started, but I think it has changed now.  Chinese student applications always involve examinations of some sort, regardless of school or major.  They took a Chinese version of the GMAT and sat through special interviews, often with other Chinese candidates, to have a mock debate in English; our IMBA is in English after all, and they needed to have a decent command of English in order to join.  Foreign students had to take the GMAT and sit individually for an English interview with a panel of professors and administrators.  All students had to submit the requisite application materials.  One thing that was unusual was the requirement of a copy of my undergraduate diploma.  I think that is normal for Chinese candidates for post-graduate study.

The difference in living arrangements among classmates is akin to the difference in pay among colleagues.  When Chinese came to my apartment, they never said anything outright, but I wondered what they thought of my accommodations in comparison to the dormitories.

I should note that foreign students living on campus live in different dorms than the local students.  There is no way we could all share the same dorm; there are special foreign student dorms for the university’s entire foreign student population, and they are expensive with limited amenities (except the daily cleaning lady, admittedly that is a luxury).  It is thus not economical for foreign students to live on campus; they can find much more affordable and better accommodations off campus.

It is understandable and yet unfortunate that the difference in dorms reinforces a difference between local and foreign.  that was a slightly uncomfortable elephant in the room that we never quite knew how to address.  We just tried not to focus on it our put ourselves in situations where that would be brought irrevocably to light.  Much like one might if differences in salary were apparent.

Our MBA director is a great woman who tries to strike a balance between uniting us all in our professional development, and showing how we can all draw on our individual skills and experiences (foreigners who know global/western business practices, locals who know China and China’s business revolution) to help each other grow.

What’s your post MBA plan? Do you plan to return to your home country? Or you plan to stay in China indefinitely?

I plan to stay, not only because my fiancé and I are both here and like it here, but because the only way to really drive home the purpose of doing my MBA here is to apply it.  An MBA on Chinese soil is a great starting point, but it won’t give you the real experience of what happens when you sign deals with local partners, or combat piracy, plan Chinese PR events, go to KTV with potential clients, or negotiate cooperation with employees in another department, or what you really should do if your boss is Chinese and you are foreign, or vice versa.  So, I plan to stay to work.

At this point, my fiancé and I are here indefinitely.  We find that we can not only function in this environment, we rather enjoy it.  China is on the up and up, so naturally it makes professional sense to stay here, but we find we are also very excited about supporting China’s expansion.  Many back home see the "rise of China" as a threat, and indeed, journalists use that phrase to no end and create a zero-sum relationship between East and West.  But what about the rise of China for the sake of the Chinese people?  What about the rise in education standards, or in standard or living, and the opening up of a culture that for the better part of the last 5000 years has been closed?  Any nation has citizens who feel proud to be citizens, and the Chinese are almost feeling that collectively.  We find that rather wonderful, and hope to be a part of that.  I am American and Chinese now.

A lot of young professionals in the U.S. and other part of the worlds are considering to move to China. What advice do you have for them?

The Chinese are a wary bunch, and with just cause; just look at their history.  If anyone comes here to work, understand that whatever your actual intentions, you are assumed to be here as a career move, and just to have fun.  If that’s what you want then no one will argue with you, but they might not trust you.  China is looking for team players, people who can join in the pursuit of their goals, and you should try to "care" about these goals.   Ask yourself before you get here if you have anything in your past that indicates you can do that.  Why?  Because the best way for local teammates/managers/direct reports to trust you is to see that you have this kind of character.  So, be prepared to take time to build trust with others, demonstrate trust, and demonstrate dedication to China’s goals. 

Work on Chinese.  It is such a beneficial tool in working in China, and is a great demonstration of your willingness to meet the Chinese halfway.  Even if you are in the Beijing office of a European multinational company where the working language is English or French, if more than 60-70% of employees are local Chinese, learn Chinese now.

Lastly, manage your expectations about China.  All the movies you’ve seen about China are not China, they are stylized versions of China that is easy on the eyes, ears and heart.  Think about how you measure the following things:  Success, Ease, Difficulty, Logic, Cheap, Expensive, Fairness, Effort, Improvement, "Good" and "Bad".  Now consider that what makes cultures different is the way they view, measure, and value those same things.  Be prepared for different views and standards, he willing to change your expectations, and roll with it!

No one’s asking you to fake your personality and character in order to have a good time and good job here.  So, hopefully you can self-select by asking whether you are open enough to try to love living abroad and respect another culture. 

Anything else you want to share with us about your experience in China.

In bullet points:

• I’ve been here for just over 5 years now and I’m still learning new things about China.
• Real Chinese food is truly, truly wonderful!  You have no idea.
• Coffee from the Yunnan province is pretty darn good.
• I hit another growth spurt in Chinese when I was working by trying really hard to speak Chinese with colleagues all the time.  Even more of an impetus was having Chinese bosses/managers.  if they are at a senior manager or director level, chances are they have worked REALLY hard to get there, and/or are extremely talented, and it would behoove you to learn from them.
• Beware of haircuts in China – take a friend with you who speaks Chinese!  They are so into fashionable hair styles that it gets a little out of hand sometimes…
• Try not to just recreate the standard of living in your home country here without adapting.  You won’t experience as much about China, and it is something that will exacerbate the differences between you and local colleagues.

Related posts:

• Seven Lessons I learned from attending business school during recession
• Five alternative careers for MBAs
• To the Unemployed MBA Applicant: Look for Opportunity and Hedge Your Bets
• An in-depth look into MBA Admission Consulting
• A brief survey of the MBA admission consulting market
• 7 tips to improve your chance to get into a top business school

My favorite books about China:

• Red China Blues: My Long March From Mao to Now
• A Comrade Lost and Found: A Beijing Memoir
• River Town: Two Years on the Yangtze (P.S.)
• Waiting

Over the past decade, I have become much better in figuring out what I want. A critical lesson I learned is the importance of defining my Non-Negotiables for personal and professional situations.

Let me share with you a story.

In 2002, right after I was laid off from a start-up, I decided to apply business school. It wasn’t the best time to apply business school as I was unemployed, and the number of applications were shooting through the roof.

However, I also knew that I needed to have clear reasons to attend business schools. Otherwise, I would be wasting a lot of money and getting very little in return. In other words, I needed to know what I wanted to get out of business school.

After thinking through my situation, I defined a few Non-Negotiables — these were things that I would absolutely not compromise.

• I would only attend a business school outside of the Silicon Valley. Although the bay area has two of the best MBA programs, I knew that I needed to get out of my comfort zone, and study and live in a different geographical area.
• I had worked in enterprise software for several years. I didn’t feel fulfilled. I wanted to work on product and services to make people’s lives better. I wanted to work on something that my family and friends would use. So, post MBA school, I wanted to work in consumer product or service. I would not return to the lucrative enterprise software space.
• I was a technical person my whole life. The key area of development for me was soft skills. I wanted to attend a school that had a track record for teaching soft skills.
• The two-year in business school would be mostly likely my last chance to enroll in school for an extended period of time. I wanted to focus on learning and enjoy the student life style. I didn’t want to have any financial concerns.

It’s debatable whether all of my Non-Negotiables were right — everyone’s situation is different. For me, at that point of time, they were the right ones.

I stuck to my list of Non-Negotiables.

Unlike most applicants who applied several schools, I only applied two schools because only those two schools fit all of my criteria. I was extremely focused on these two applications because they were my only chances. I ended up getting into both schools with average academic record and professional experience.

I had a hard time to find an internship and a full-time job. During the recession, companies wanted to hire people with experience. It was incredibly difficult for me to get a job in a consumer product or service company. I was among a small group of students who didn’t have a job at time of graduation. At that time, several enterprise software companies were very interested in me. But, I decided not to interview with any of them. It was not easy — when most of my classmates were travelling around to enjoy their time before starting new jobs, I was still working my tail off to look for a job. I remembered one MBA friend said to me: "I cannot believe that you’re still looking for a job". He was about to start his job at an investment bank.

Again, I stuck to my Non-Negotiables. Three months after graduation, I had three job offers in my hands. All of them were in consumer internet space. This experience gave me tremendous amount of confidence — it doesn’t matter how grim the situation is, I know that I can stick to my guns and prevail.

To make sure that I didn’t need to worry about money matters during business school, I took out maximum amount of student loans. I had some savings and could have borrowed less. But, I wanted to fully enjoy my two years in school without worrying about finances. During these two years, I lived in Europe for one month. I traveled to nine national parks in eleven states. I skied in Whistler. I drove around Florida. I took short trips to LA, Seattle, and New York City. I never regret the money I spent on those trips. I ended up with a sizable amount of loan to pay back. But, I don’t mind at all. For the next 15 to 20 years, with kids and family, I will not have the time and luxury to travel to these many places.

To stick to my Non-Negotiables, I have to make trade offs. Instead of applying more schools to give me better chance to get into a school, I had to be very focused and work extra hard to get into the two schools I applied. To get my desired job in consumer product, I had to keep fighting until the end to get a job offer. To do all of the fun travels, I had to borrow more money. But, having the set of Non-Negotiables gave me clarity. They guided my decisions.

You can have many different type of Non-Negotiables. Some are personal. Some are professionals. Some are long term. Some are short term.

I want to challenge you to think about your Non-Negotiables:

• What are your Non-Negotiables when you’re looking for your next job?
• What are your Non-Negotiables when you’re managing others?
• What are your Non-Negotiables when you’re teaching your kids?
• What are your Non-Negotiables when you’re looking for someone to marry?
• What are your Non-Negotiables when you’re dealing with unethical situations at work?
• What are you  Non-Negotiables when you’re buying a car?

Different situation calls for different set of Non-Negotiables. I encourage you to go through this process. It’ll give more clarity and determination to carry through.

Related posts

• Do you have an identity outside of work?
• The first time I cried at work
• Don’t get stuck
• Preview: How to Get Into Top MBA Program After Layoff

Excellent resources

• Smart Choices: A Practical Guide to Making Better Decisions
• Thinking Strategically: The Competitive Edge in Business, Politics, and Everyday Life
• Co-Opetition : A Revolution Mindset That Combines Competition and Cooperation : The Game Theory Strategy That’s Changing the Game of Business

I have worked hard to put together How To Get Into Top MBA Program After Layoff, a premium report you can purchase at Scribd.com Digital Bookstore.

Below is a preview I would like to share with fellow GeekMBA360.com readers. Happy New Year!

My Story

The layoff "ruined" my master plan.

I graduated from college in 1997. With a Computer Science degree and a red hot job market, I was flying high. After a couple of stints at a large management consulting firm and a fast-growing, medium sized enterprise software company, I joined an Internet start-up that was backed by three top venture capital firms in the Silicon Valley.

My plan

I didn’t want to miss the dot com gold rush. But, I also knew that there were tremendous amount of risk associated with start-ups. If it didn’t work out, my plan was to attend a top business school to get an MBA. In the start-up company I worked for, I was the only product manager without an MBA. Five of my product management colleagues were recent MBA graduates from Stanford Business School.

I did a lot of research about applying top MBA programs. I identified people who could write my recommendations. I worked really hard to be a star at work. I got involved in volunteer activities. I felt that in a couple of years, I would have built an excellent resume of career advancement and leadership activities to make me a strong candidate for top MBA programs.

The problem

Things didn’t work according to my plan.

Less than 11 months after I joined the start-up, it laid off 50% of its employees. I was one of the victims.

The dot com bubble was bursting everywhere. There were a lot of unemployed, hungry, and frustrated young professionals hanging out in cafes, backpacking in developing countries, or moving back to live with parents.

Quarterlife Crisis was a popular read among young professionals at that time.

I was one of them. I wasn’t sure what to do next. I felt that I was in a very awkward position.

• I knew that I wanted to apply a top MBA program. But, how could I explain my layoff to the admission committee?
• Should I bet everything on going to a MBA program, and spend all of my time and energy to apply MBA programs in the next three months while I was unemployed?
• A lot of young professionals were applying business schools during the recession. The competition was fierce. What if I was rejected by all of the MBA programs?
• What if I was able to get another job? Should I stayed at the company for a couple of years before I applied business school? I knew that MBA schools didn’t like job hoppers. I was at the start-up for less than one year, which looked bad on my resume.
• Should I even apply MBA program? Maybe I’m better off by focusing on getting another job.

After the layoff, I spent three weeks to decompress, "relax", reflect, and figure out my next steps.

I remember for several days immediately after I got laid off, I went to a coworker’s apartment, watching TV, drinking beers, and commiserating about our bad lucks. But, I was really anxious, and stressed out inside. After a week, I told myself that I needed a structure, and a plan. I didn’t want to waste my time.

I spent a lot of time in cafes, writing down all of my thoughts. The writing process really helped me organize my thoughts. There were a lot of conflicting ideas, emotions, and thoughts in my mind. My ego also took a hit as I was laid off. I thought I did a good job, but why I was laid off while some "slacker colleagues" kept their jobs?

After about a week of reflection and thinking, I felt much better.

I told myself three things

• It’s bad that I was laid off. But, to put things into perspective, it’s much better that I got my first layoff when I was 26 years old, and single. I should be thankful for the experience, and not let it happen again to me when I got older with more family responsibilities.
• I would aggressively look for a job AND apply MBA program at the same time. I needed to do both.
• I needed to create a structure for myself. Otherwise, I would be wasting my time everyday by surfing the Internet, hanging out with other unemployed friends, sleeping in, and feeling depressed.

The outcome?

• I got a job offer with 15% pay raise in six weeks.
• I applied two top 5 MBA programs, and were accepted by both. According to official MBA admission statistics, it was the most competitive year ever in the history of MBA admission.

The layoff "ruined" my master plan. But, I made "game time adjustment", and figured out a better game plan that worked.

Let me share with you the specifics of my plan, and how I executed.

You can purchase the document at Scribd.com Digital Bookstore.

I’m 32 year old. I’m currently first-year student at a top MBA program. I got a 750 on GMAT. I’ve founded a non-profit organization.  I was promoted twice at work before I went back to school. I’m currently the president of a student club.

But, I’m really depressed.

As  you know, it’s really competitive to get a summer internship now. My dream is to become a McKinsey management consultant. It’s simply the most prestigious job in the world. I have wanted to work for McKinsey since I was five years old.

But, McKinsey’s job application asked me for SAT and my undergraduate GPA in addition to my GMAT score and graduate GPA. It’s too late for me to do anything with my undergraduate GPA, but I was thinking about re-taking the SAT since I had a mediocre score when I was in high school. But, it would take quite a bit of time for me to prepare for SAT, probably signed up a Kaplan class. Would you recommend me to re-take the SAT? Please advise. "

Thanks in advance,

Jerry

Okay. Let me confess first. I made up this letter. But, I can guarantee you that the content of this letter was absolutely based on actual conversations I had with people.

I attended business school during the last recession. Internship recruiting in Fall, 2002 was incredibly difficult. People were looking for every edge they could possible have to improve their chance to get an internship offer from their dream employers.

Several people told me that they were really concerned about their qualifications because they had low SAT scores. They were thinking about re-taking it. They wanted to do everything in their control to improve their chance with employers such as McKinsey, Bain, Boston Consulting, etc.

When we had mock-up interview practices, we were told that we needed to demonstrate passion. People were taking the "passion advice" very seriously. The investment banking and equity research wannabes were starting saying to interviewers that they had a calling for stock market since they were five years old. Just like Warren Buffet, they started picking stocks when they were in elementary schools.

The consulting wannabes were talking about how much they loved problem solving, and how they conducted their thinking the McKinsey way. That’s how their minds were wired by mother nature. They were born to work for McKinsey.

My examples might be exaggerating a little bit, but not much. After talking to many investment banking and management consulting wannabes, I can tell you that most of them didn’t get into banking or consulting because they had a true passion for these two professions.

They got into these two lines of work because 1) they could potentially make a lot of money 2) they would have the flexibility to make lateral moves to other career paths down the road 3) they didn’t like what they did professionally before business school. They wanted to do something different.

I also don’t understand why employers such as McKinsey and Google cares so much about candidates historical academic record.

San Francisco Chronicle recently ran a very interesting article: Google Talent Search: Error 502? Google has come out to dispute some of the statements in the article, which was included in the "Update" section of the article. I encouraged you to read this article and form your own opinion.

This reminds of an excellent talk given by Tom Siebel at Kellogg School of Management. Here is my favorite quote from his talk:

"You graduate from one of the best business schools on the planet.

Once you get out of here, it wouldn’t make any difference at all.

There is no correlation between business success and grades, test scores, or the schools you graduated. None. "

Here is the entire video recording of Tom Siebel’s talk. (You can hear the aforementioned quotes at about 9 minute 30 seconds mark.)

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If you have never been to Montana, you should definitely visit it once in your life time. When you get there, you’ll understand why it’s called big sky country. It’s beautiful, wide open, calm, and down-to-earth. In the small town we visited, most families still don’t lock their doors. It’s like going back to the 1950′s.

We stayed at a lake side lodge. It has a restaurant and a bar in the front, and motel rooms in the back. During the day, we went out to plant trees, helped renovate historical train depot, gave talks to local high school students from disadvantaged social-economic background, etc. At night, we hung out in the bar, playing pools and darts.

The bartender was just like any bartender in America, wearing a T-Shirt, a pair of jeans, and occasionally a baseball cap.

One night we had a "team building" activity. There was a grass area on top of a small hill behind the lodge. The bartender helped us set up a bonfire. As we were preparing food and getting ready for the activities, several of us chatted with the bartender.

He asked us what our group was about. We told him that we were a group of first-year MBA students. We came to Montana to work on service projects as well as building camaraderie among ourselves.

He started asking us about what we did in the past, what we planned to do after business school, etc. Our answers were pretty typical: investment banking, management consulting, brand management, high tech, etc.

He asked us about what finance classes we would be taking. We talked about the national economy, the stock market, and efficient market theory.

It soon became apparent to everyone that the bartender knew a lot about finance.

One of us asked him: "You seems to know a lot about finance. Have you worked in finance before?"

He smiled. Then, he said, "Actually, I worked in finance for many years. My most recent job was the Chief Investment Officer at Chase. Before that, I ran the state pension fund for Montana. But, I got tired of working on the Wall Street. I knew the owner of this lodge, and came down here to help. I love bartending."

It was the perfect setting for a conversation like this. In a remote and peaceful area of Montana, a group of ambitious, career-driven MBA students, and a former Chief Investor Officer at a major bank who quitted his high-paying job to become a bartender in Montana.

For many of us, it was a wake-up call.

One could sugarcoat it in many ways. But, let’s face it, based on my own interactions with fellow MBA students, the typical MBA students share a few things in common:

• they’re ambitious and driven
• they want to make a lot of money
• they want to move to the top of the corporate ladder

There are exceptions. For example, some people want to get into social or non profit sectors. But, even those people, tend to change their minds during business school or switch to for-profit sector a few years after business school.

I have heard some variations of the following statements MANY times:

"I know Investment Banking/Management Consulting is long hours. I’m willing to have no life for a few years or even ten years. Then, I’ll make enough money to retire and enjoy the rest of the my life."

My questions for those folks are:

• how do you know you’ll be able to live that long? Life is very unpredictable.
• how do you know that you will be able to make enough money by working really hard? Hard working doesn’t necessarily translate to career success
• how to you know your career will progress to the point that you will be able to retire?
• what would you do to enjoy your life once you retire? A lot of people are so hard-working that they don’t know how to enjoy life.

It’s better to never retire.

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Like many things in life, Management Consulting is not as good as some people think, and it is not as bad as some people think. Overall, my view on Management Consulting is more positive than my view on investment banking.

I tend to discourage people from getting into investment banking, but occasionally I would encourage people get into management consulting if I think they can benefit from the training and industry exposure brought by management consulting.

Management Consulting is a very loosely defined term. It could mean many different things. For the purpose of this article, I’m going to narrowly focus on "strategic consulting firms" such as McKinsey, Boston Consulting Group, and Bain Company. These are the three most well-known firms in this space. Other well-known firms include Monitor, Mercer, Mars, LEK, etc. There is also a growing number of "boutique strategic consulting firms". "Big 4" consulting firms such as Deloitte, PWC, Accenture also have strategic consulting practices.

The Good

I know many former and current management consultants. I can say that overwhelming majority of them are bright, intellectually curious, and communicative. It’s fun and easy to carry a conversation with them.

Management Consulting firms have very competitive selection process. They tend to hire analysts from only the top undergraduate programs, and hire associates from only the top business/law/graduate programs. So, almost all of the consultants are "academically smart". If you’re the type of person who enjoys an academic, intellectual discussion with your colleague, I think management consulting provides a better environment than most other industries.

Over the year I have also developed a very health respect for the professionalism of management consulting professionals. When I was working at one of the aforementioned management consulting firms, whenever I called a colleague, he or she would always return my call. Whenever I asked a question in the firm’s knowledge base, I could always expect someone answering my question. Whenever I set up a meeting, my colleagues would show up on time. I’ve never experienced this kind of professionalism since I left management consulting.

I joined a management consulting firm fresh out college. I was a computer science major in college. I was not as "polished" and "business ready" as some of my classmates. Management Consulting provided me great training. I learned how to interact with clients. I was exposed to several industries, which really helped me figure out what industries I wanted to work in the future. I also traveled a little bit since I had to work for different clients at different locations. I was young and single, so I really enjoyed the travelling experience.

However, I do want to say that business travel gets tired after a while. I was fortunate that I only worked in management consulting for a little bit over a  year, so traveling never wore out on me.

The Bad

Have you wondered why management consulting exists? A mentor of mine once told me that "management consulting firms exist largely for political reasons".

This is a very profound statement and it is very true.

When large companies need to make controversial decisions such as cost cutting, layoffs, or strategic changes", instead of taking on all of the responsibilities (and potentially blames), it’s "wise" for the senior management team to bring in outside "expert management consultant" to provide 3rd-party opinions/recommendations. It makes the decision more "legitimate", and help reduce senior management team’s risk (i.e. you cannot put all of the blame on me — it was recommended by McKinsey.)

Of course this is not the only reason that management consulting firm exists. But, it’s a very important reason. And that’s why I quitted management consulting.

I worked at several client projects. At each client site, I’d spend a few months there. But, I was never really part of the company. I was simply going in, doing some research, making a few presentations, and giving some recommendations. I never saw my recommendation being implemented. I didn’t feel that I was making any impact — I didn’t see tangible results.

I started questioning myself — how did I know my recommendation was correct? It was my first job out of college. Many of my seniors in the project team had been in consulting for their whole career. They didn’t have the from-the-trenches operational experience. They were all very smart and quick-study. They could learn a lot about a company in a very short period of time. But, sometime I felt that we were like a group of medical school students who had studied medicine for two years but had never operated on any patient. But, we were making recommendation about how to do surgeries. There were a lot of assumptions, modeling, and intellectual thought experiments.

The Ugly

Similar to investment banking, management consulting firms have a reverse pyramid organization structure. Analysts and associates are at the bottom of the pyramids. They’re asked to work long hours. In term of career progression, you’re either "up or out". Certain number of people will become managers, principals, partners, etc. If your time is up and you don’t make to the next level, you’re out.

It’s less an issue for entry-level analysts since you’re expected to go back to business school to get your MBA after working at the firm for a couple of years. But, once you’re an associate, your career path is "up or out". That’s a lot of pressure. It could get quite political and demoralizing.

Also, I’ve found that some management consulting professionals have developed an "elitist mentality" over the years. They tend to be really good student throughout their lives. They attended really good universities. They then went through a very competitive process to get into McKinsey, Bain, BCG, etc. After working in those firms for a year or two, although they might not like the intensity and pressure of management consulting, they felt that their employers were the most prestigious companies in the worlds. They simply felt that there wasn’t much option outside of the management consulting firms. Basically, they stuck. They didn’t like their jobs, but they felt that it’d be "a step down" to switch to a non management-consulting company.

My advice for those folks is simple: Management Consulting is just a job. It’s no more or less prestigious than other corporate jobs. Focus on your true career interest. If your heart tells you that you no longer like your management consulting job, then look around. Don’t let the "prestige factor" prevent you from trying something new and different.

What do you think?

I’m interesting to hear from all of you – do you agree or disagree with my view on the good, bad, and ugly of management consulting?

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I was a computer science major, and Caleb studied economics. But, computer was Caleb’s hobby since he was a little kid. So, he took several computer science classes with me. We worked on many computer science projects together, pulling countless nighters.

Caleb was a brilliant computer programmer. Although he wasn’t major in computer science, he could have gotten a software development job anywhere he wanted.

But, Caleb’s career goal was to work for an investment bank. He was really into high finance. He took graduate-level finance classes when he was still an undergraduate. At that time, the "hottest employers" on campus were investment banks and management consulting firms such as Golden Sachs, Morgan Stanley, McKinsey, Bain, Boston Consulting Group, etc. Caleb had his eyes fixed on the top investment banks.

Caleb had read Liar’s Poker: Rising Through the Wreckage on Wall Street. He told me that the first two-year of his banking career would be like hell. He was prepared to fully dedicated himself to the banking job for two years, and then went back to school to get an MBA. He was prepared intellectually, emotionally, and mentally for the grind of investment banking.

In the end, Caleb was hired by one of the top two investment banks. The bank only extended one offer that year out of hundreds of applicants. Caleb was thrilled. Caleb started working for the bank in San Francisco late that summer.

Soon after Caleb started working, he disappeared from his friends. He was working day and night. He was working in the weekends. Although I was one of his closest friends and I was only 30-minute BART ride from him, I rarely saw him.

Several of us went to visit him one Friday evening at his nice 39th floor office in one of the tallest buildings in SF. He chatted with us for about 15 minutes, but he couldn’t go to dinner with us because he had to work.

He showed up on campus several times because he was part of the campus recruiting team for his employer. He would show up at the campus event, well-dressed, but look dead tired. We, his college buddies, would go to chat with him after the corporation presentation. He sounded really tense and business-like. He had to conduct himself in certain way. Most presentations ended around 7PM. He would head right back to work.

He ate all of his meals at work. Every night his employer ordered food for all of them.

A few months later, around the Christmas holiday, I had a chat with Caleb. He was stressed, tired, frustrated, and angry.

He had started to lose hair. This was a healthy young man who was only twenty-two years old. He told me that he took a business trip to the corporate headquarter in New York city. Every single male VP or above he saw at the corporate headquarter were balding. He told me that it was not uncommon for the young analysts and associates to start losing hair.

I asked Caleb what kept him so busy. He told me that as an investment banking analyst, you’re basically doing a lot of paper shoving. His work was like a secretary, proof-reading piles and piles of documents, and getting them delivered to clients under very tight deadline. It’s very high pressure for very mundane and tedious work.

In the investment banking industry, the organizational structure was a reversed pyramid. In his office, Caleb was the only analyst. There were a couple of associates, four VPs, and several directors. Basically, all of the tedious works were pushed down to the analysts and associates.

Analysts and associates made good money. But, if you divided their salaries by the actual hours they worked, the pay wasn’t great at all!

But, what’s worse was the culture of investment banking. There was little respect to individuals. It’s very hierarchical. The VPs or directors would curse at people when they got into an arguments. To put it mildly, many of the investment bankers would not pass Professor Sutton’s No Asshole Rule.

So, Caleb hated his job. He wanted to get out. In fact, he was so fed up with banking that he didn’t care about his career path any more.

He had a strategy and a plan. His annual bonus would be deposited to his bank account exactly one year after his start date. Before his "liberation day”, Caleb cleaned his locker. He removed all of the files on his computer. On the day that he got his bonus, he checked his checking account and made sure that the bonus money was wired into his account.

Then, Caleb walked into his managing director office around noon, and said "today is my last day. I’m done." The MD in the office was livid, and started cursing and shouting.

Caleb simply walked away.

Caleb never looked back. Today he work in a field that he would never have imagined or planned ten years ago. But, his career is thriving. He is in control of his own destiny. He is doing just fine without climbing the investment banking ladder and getting an MBA.

Caleb burned the bridge with the bank. He did something that every career advisor would advise against.

But, apparently, his story was quickly passed among wall street junior analysts. Even a few years after he quitted, people are still talking about what he did.

He simply did something that a lot of people wished they would have done.

Disclaimer: This is a true story. But, to protect confidentiality, the names in this story have been changed.

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When I was attending business school, one thing I enjoyed the least was the herd-like mentality –- there was tremendous amount of peer pressure to follow the crowed to pursue one of the traditional MBA career paths such as investment banking, management consulting, brand management, or high tech. So, I have developed a very healthy respect for MBAs who have taken the road less travelled by pursuing an “alternative” career path.

I supposed it’s hard to define “alternative”. For the sake for this article, when I say “alternative career choices”, I mean the career choices that are not typical for an MBA graduate.

Below is my list of five alternative career choices some MBAs have taken.

Sports Analytics

If you’ve read Moneyball: The Art of Winning an Unfair Game, you know how important a role data analytics could play in drafting professional athletes and running a pro sports team. In this year’s NBA playoff, Houston Rocket was the only team who took the eventual champion L.A. Lakers to a game 7. But, do you know that the Houston Rocket is run by a general Manager who has never played professional basketball, who has an undergraduate degree in computer science, and an MBA from MIT Sloan School of Business? His name is Daryl Morey, who puts his faith in numbers. Now he just needs to get them to add up to another title. MIT Sloan even offers a Sports Analytics Conference.

Improve public education

Take on full-time managerial role in a school district or charter management organization. The prestigious Broad Residency is a “two-year leadership development program that places participants into full-time high-level managerial positions in school districts and charter management organizations (CMOs), where they can have an immediate impact on the education of America’s students.” 89% of Broad Residency alumni continue to work in public education, and 72% of alumni work in district or CMOs.

Become a franchisee

According to this New York Times article, an increasing number of business school graduates and corporate executives are going into low-tech franchises like Dukin’s Donuts and gas station. I happened to know one of the MBAs mentioned in the article – running a franchise could be very lucrative and providing an alternative income stream to supplement (or even replace) the not-so-stable corporate gig.

Start your own non-profit organization to change the world

John Wood, a Kellogg MBA and an overworked Microsoft executive, founded Room to Read, which strives to provide children access to education, one child at a time, one school at a time, and one village at a time. John Wood also wrote a great book, Leaving Microsoft to Change the World, talking about his experience of starting and running Room to Read. It was a very inspirational read.

Strike on your own

From laid-off banker to Wall Street tour guide: Andrew Luan is a MIT Sloan graduate. He was a former vice president at Deutsche Bank who traded CDOs. After getting laid off, he started  Wall Street Experience LLC, which offers the Financial Crisis Tour.

Given the shortage of jobs, it’s conceivable that more and more MBAs will choose to strike on their own.

The not-alternative-any-more-career-choice: I intentionally left out working for the US Federal Government as an alternative career choice for MBA – more and more MBAs will be working for the US Government. It’s going “mainstream”.

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But, what made him feel even worse was the tone and content of the ding letter — not only they informed him that LBS won’t offer him a space on the MBA program, they also told him not to apply again.

The reader wasn’t sure if he understood the message correctly, so he emailed the LBS admission office again, asking them to clarify if they didn’t want him to apply again. And he got a confirmation.

This is someone who has spent a lot of time, money and effort on his application. LBS said that they had informed a small group of applicants to reapply next year — a lot of things could change in a year. What made LBS to decide that they knew which candidate should apply next year? Why not give everyone a chance?

A lot of factors could go into an application. An applicant might simply did a very poor job to market himself/herself. He/she could do much better in the following year. 

The application process is difficult. Every candidate puts in a lot of effort. They deserve better treatment from admission offices.

Applicants deserve more humility and respect from LBS admission office. For me, the sheer arrogance and tasteless ding letter from LBS admission is simply embarrassing.

Below are the initial ding letter from LBS, and a subsequent email from LBS. Names have been removed to protect confidentiality. Also, I’ve bolded certain sentences.

Initial Ding Letter from London Business School (LBS):

From: <Admission Officer Name> <email address>
To: <applicant>
Sent: Thursday, June 4, 2009 
Subject: London Business School Decision

Dear <applicant name>
Thank you for submitting your application for a place on the London Business School Full-time MBA Programme commencing in August 2009 (MBA2011).

Members of the MBA Admissions Committee have now carefully considered your application.  It is with regret that we have been asked by the Committee to inform you that they are not able to offer you a place on the MBA Programme this year.  The applicant pool has again been of an extremely high calibre, and consequently competition has been very rigorous.

The MBA Admissions Committee has asked me to advise you that their current decision is final and confidential. Regrettably, no appeals can be considered, and we are unable to provide individual feedback. We have included some general feedback for you below.

Admissions for the London Business School MBA are very competitive this year and we have to make some really tough decisions. We are very sorry to disappoint you and wish you every success in the future. There are however other options detailed below you may like to consider.

Yours sincerely,
MBA Marketing & Admissions Team
London Business School

Should I reapply?
This is a decision for you, but you should know that we do specifically invite those candidates we actively wish to reapply. You should also note that competition for places is tough each year.

You may like to consider applying for one of the other world-class programmes offered by London Business School , such as those available through our Executive Education portfolio. In particular, our Emerging Leaders Programme may be of interest to you. This intensive three week programme is designed for high potential individuals in, or about to take on, their first management role, and who are looking to fast-track their career progression. For information on applying for this or one of our other Executive Education programmes, contact Tim Pearson in our Client Services Team on +44 (0)20 7000 7391 or email elp@london.edu

How do I reapply?
If you do intend to reapply, you must complete a new application and send it to us with the correct application fee.  We can only hold original transcripts and references from your first application for one year.  To improve your chances of admission the new application must highlight aspects of personal and professional growth or list improvements made in areas of academic weakness. Unfortunately we are unable to predict your chances of admission if you make a new application, as the applicant pool changes from year to year. Please remember that competition for places is intense and we have to make some difficult choices.

Applicant emailed LBS admission asking for clarification

From: Applicant 
To: <admission officer name>
Subject: Re: London Business School Decision

Since there is no invitation for me to reapply, does it mean I am not considered a competitive candidate?

<Applicant>

LBS Reply after Applicant asked for clarification

Dear <Applicant>

I am sorry that you received disappointing news in relation to your MBA2011 application to London Business School .

I’m afraid that we cannot give any personalised feedback on applications and, in fairness to all candidates, will not make any exception to this rule. I think you can appreciate that the large number of applications we receive does not allow us to give individualised comments on admissions decisions. It is also the Admissions Committee’s policy not to discuss their decisions any further as they are final and without appeal.

You are of course welcome to re-apply next year but please bear in mind that we do ask a small number of candidates to re-apply when sending out our admission decisions if we deem their application to be promising. As the selection is very competitive, we recommend that you only re-apply to the School if you have been invited to do so and if there has been a major change to your application or you can demonstrate a significant progress in your career.

Best of luck with all your future endeavours,

<Admission Officer Name>

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